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	<title>Comments on: Rant in the Key of Women at Conferences</title>
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	<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/</link>
	<description>Christine from the Internet sometimes has things to say.</description>
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		<title>By: Montreal Tech Watch &#187; Upcoming: BitNorth August 27th to 29th @ Lake McDonald</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-166598</link>
		<dc:creator>Montreal Tech Watch &#187; Upcoming: BitNorth August 27th to 29th @ Lake McDonald</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Aug 2010 15:04:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-166598</guid>
		<description>[...] try very hard to find a male/female balance. Christine (@_hristine) wrote about this and I firmly believe that having a balance there makes a huge difference to the conference vibe and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] try very hard to find a male/female balance. Christine (@_hristine) wrote about this and I firmly believe that having a balance there makes a huge difference to the conference vibe and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: caycos</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159544</link>
		<dc:creator>caycos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Dec 2009 03:42:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159544</guid>
		<description>I work for the Wellington office of an AU software company. We have 19 staff, 17 male... It makes for a somewhat interesting dynamic.

I think the type of work I do lends itself more to guys. In particular, we do a fair bit of travel, which means longer hours and being away from home. This being the case, women who (somewhat by default) are the ones who mostly look after the kids aren&#039;t really in a position to be regularly be away. That, coupled with the fact that we mostly hire PMs and technical consultants which have a male bias anyway, means we just have more boys.

I think if I had young children, I would not want to be doing my current job. The one other female in the office has a 2 year old, and I think she finds it hard.

Fortunately, for the most part, my boss hires clever people who just happen to be male, so it&#039;s a good environment to be in. But one or two more females wouldn&#039;t go astray.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I work for the Wellington office of an AU software company. We have 19 staff, 17 male&#8230; It makes for a somewhat interesting dynamic.</p>
<p>I think the type of work I do lends itself more to guys. In particular, we do a fair bit of travel, which means longer hours and being away from home. This being the case, women who (somewhat by default) are the ones who mostly look after the kids aren&#8217;t really in a position to be regularly be away. That, coupled with the fact that we mostly hire PMs and technical consultants which have a male bias anyway, means we just have more boys.</p>
<p>I think if I had young children, I would not want to be doing my current job. The one other female in the office has a 2 year old, and I think she finds it hard.</p>
<p>Fortunately, for the most part, my boss hires clever people who just happen to be male, so it&#8217;s a good environment to be in. But one or two more females wouldn&#8217;t go astray.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodger</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159218</link>
		<dc:creator>Rodger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 21:13:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159218</guid>
		<description>Couldn&#039;t sleep.  It happens on an annoyingly regular basis.

On the hiring front, yeah, there&#039;s gotta be a baseline competence, or you&#039;re just harming, not helping; if you&#039;ve got two good people saying, &quot;Well, another woman in the team would make for a more balanced environment&quot; is a fair call.  

Hiring an incompetent because she&#039;s a woman is a terrible decision, and will likely just turn everyone off on the idea of trying to diversify their workplace, since they&#039;ll translate &quot;diversity&quot; to &quot;hiring idiots&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Couldn&#8217;t sleep.  It happens on an annoyingly regular basis.</p>
<p>On the hiring front, yeah, there&#8217;s gotta be a baseline competence, or you&#8217;re just harming, not helping; if you&#8217;ve got two good people saying, &#8220;Well, another woman in the team would make for a more balanced environment&#8221; is a fair call.  </p>
<p>Hiring an incompetent because she&#8217;s a woman is a terrible decision, and will likely just turn everyone off on the idea of trying to diversify their workplace, since they&#8217;ll translate &#8220;diversity&#8221; to &#8220;hiring idiots&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention Rant in the Key of Women at Conferences Â« Christine from the Internet -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159212</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention Rant in the Key of Women at Conferences Â« Christine from the Internet -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 20:27:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159212</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Alistair Croll, Christine. Christine said: Ladies should be @ tech confs http://bit.ly/57bWrs +can get into tech like guys http://bit.ly/5z3uvg But, well, *this*: http://bit.ly/7axNeQ [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Alistair Croll, Christine. Christine said: Ladies should be @ tech confs <a href="http://bit.ly/57bWrs" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/57bWrs</a> +can get into tech like guys <a href="http://bit.ly/5z3uvg" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/5z3uvg</a> But, well, *this*: <a href="http://bit.ly/7axNeQ" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/7axNeQ</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Christine Davis</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159206</link>
		<dc:creator>Christine Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 17:15:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159206</guid>
		<description>Dude.  It&#039;s crazy early over there.  I don&#039;t usually see life from NZ for some several hours.

I guess it would be vaguely interesting to figure out whether there are any fields which there is an even gender balance - maybe it&#039;s not a tech thing, but it just seems like a tech thing because that&#039;s where we notice it most.

Webstock invites its speakers to talk;  but I&#039;m not sure how much of a conscious effort they make to even out the numbers.  They do seem to have about 25% women pretty consistently, though.

BitNorth was really diverse in all directions.  There are a lot of tech people who go,  but there was also a strong librarian contingent (not all women!).  Talks were also all over the place (:

(If someone wanted to hire a woman to work with me, just because they were a woman, irrespective of their ability, I would probably have a grumpy if they turned out to be incompetent.  Curiously, incompetence in colleagues who are women bothers me far more than incompetent men)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dude.  It&#8217;s crazy early over there.  I don&#8217;t usually see life from NZ for some several hours.</p>
<p>I guess it would be vaguely interesting to figure out whether there are any fields which there is an even gender balance &#8211; maybe it&#8217;s not a tech thing, but it just seems like a tech thing because that&#8217;s where we notice it most.</p>
<p>Webstock invites its speakers to talk;  but I&#8217;m not sure how much of a conscious effort they make to even out the numbers.  They do seem to have about 25% women pretty consistently, though.</p>
<p>BitNorth was really diverse in all directions.  There are a lot of tech people who go,  but there was also a strong librarian contingent (not all women!).  Talks were also all over the place (:</p>
<p>(If someone wanted to hire a woman to work with me, just because they were a woman, irrespective of their ability, I would probably have a grumpy if they turned out to be incompetent.  Curiously, incompetence in colleagues who are women bothers me far more than incompetent men)</p>
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		<title>By: Rodger</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159205</link>
		<dc:creator>Rodger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 16:56:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159205</guid>
		<description>I was thinking less of the balance in the education field and more how comfortable incumbancy seems to become past a certain overwhelming point - the ease with which people seem to settle into the mindset past some (poorly defined) point where it becomes &quot;natural&quot; not to see women/men/Polynesians/etc in a given field.

Stephen was very keen in his time at the Elves to try to make a point of recruiting outside the white male nerd box, but hit the problem of finding people who weren&#039;t in that box and could do the job.  I suspect that would be a common complaint for anyone trying to improve the workplace, but conferences shouldn&#039;t have that problem, because you don&#039;t need to own the talent pool that&#039;s presenting.  It&#039;d be interesting to see how the organisers of the sucessful examples you cite went about it compared to the more normal conferences; were they lucky, or did they work at getting a more diverse range of speakers?  Are some topics better than others?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was thinking less of the balance in the education field and more how comfortable incumbancy seems to become past a certain overwhelming point &#8211; the ease with which people seem to settle into the mindset past some (poorly defined) point where it becomes &#8220;natural&#8221; not to see women/men/Polynesians/etc in a given field.</p>
<p>Stephen was very keen in his time at the Elves to try to make a point of recruiting outside the white male nerd box, but hit the problem of finding people who weren&#8217;t in that box and could do the job.  I suspect that would be a common complaint for anyone trying to improve the workplace, but conferences shouldn&#8217;t have that problem, because you don&#8217;t need to own the talent pool that&#8217;s presenting.  It&#8217;d be interesting to see how the organisers of the sucessful examples you cite went about it compared to the more normal conferences; were they lucky, or did they work at getting a more diverse range of speakers?  Are some topics better than others?</p>
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		<title>By: Christine Davis</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159201</link>
		<dc:creator>Christine Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 14:22:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159201</guid>
		<description>As a woman in an unrelated field,  I have an awareness that men being falsely accused of Doing Bad Things is an issue;  which seems like the kind of life-changing risk that is worth avoiding if you are a man thinking about education.

I also think that as a ladynerd, that if anyone had tried to overtly and directly push me into the tech field,  I probably would have dug my heels in d:  But that&#039;s another blog post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a woman in an unrelated field,  I have an awareness that men being falsely accused of Doing Bad Things is an issue;  which seems like the kind of life-changing risk that is worth avoiding if you are a man thinking about education.</p>
<p>I also think that as a ladynerd, that if anyone had tried to overtly and directly push me into the tech field,  I probably would have dug my heels in d:  But that&#8217;s another blog post.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodger</title>
		<link>http://www.neato.co.nz/archives/2009/12/15/rant-in-the-key-of-women-at-conferences/comment-page-1/#comment-159186</link>
		<dc:creator>Rodger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Dec 2009 07:49:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.neato.co.nz/?p=632#comment-159186</guid>
		<description>I think part of the problem is once there&#039;s a heavy preponderance it requires a huge effort to get anyone to think outside that status quo - Education at Vic has the opposite problem (95%+ female skewed), and any queries as to whether this may be a problem hits much the same talking points as the converse in tech: men don&#039;t want to be involved in education, we can&#039;t make people be interested, what&#039;s wrong with it anyway, and so on and so forth.

Of course, there&#039;s always outright tardery to exacerbate matters, such as the whole Rails pornstar debacle (which at least helped spur me to migrate off Typo 4.0...).

An auxiliary problem is engaging people in the field in such a way they don&#039;t feel like they&#039;re being blamed if they haven&#039;t done anything blameworthy so there&#039;s not a defensive reaction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think part of the problem is once there&#8217;s a heavy preponderance it requires a huge effort to get anyone to think outside that status quo &#8211; Education at Vic has the opposite problem (95%+ female skewed), and any queries as to whether this may be a problem hits much the same talking points as the converse in tech: men don&#8217;t want to be involved in education, we can&#8217;t make people be interested, what&#8217;s wrong with it anyway, and so on and so forth.</p>
<p>Of course, there&#8217;s always outright tardery to exacerbate matters, such as the whole Rails pornstar debacle (which at least helped spur me to migrate off Typo 4.0&#8230;).</p>
<p>An auxiliary problem is engaging people in the field in such a way they don&#8217;t feel like they&#8217;re being blamed if they haven&#8217;t done anything blameworthy so there&#8217;s not a defensive reaction.</p>
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